I asked two Envelope forum moderators, who are also brilliant Emmy experts — Chris Beachum ("Boomer") and Robert Licuria (former nickname "Xanadu") — to share their reactions to Emmy nominations. When I read what they wrote, I found myself disagreeing so passionately, that I decided to jump into the mix and stir up one of our famous Envelope/GoldDerby fights. (You know how much I love those!)

Robert Licuria: First of all, ATAS has got to get rid of the panels. They made so many bad and — may I say? — unpopular choices. Yes, this is not a popularity contest, but, wow, so many left-field choices. And it seems that the panels didn't help marginal networks, just marginal shows on the big 4 nets.

Chris Beachum (Boomer): Totally agreed. Some of these nominees are among the worst ever, and this will no doubt be the lowest-rated Emmy Awards of all time. On the comedy side, you actually brought up a good point recently. Live audience shows (as opposed to single-camera shows) would do better with Emmy voters. You were right.

Tom O'Neil: I think these are some of the gutsiest and best Emmy nominations ever. I agree that they failed to achieve their goal to boost shows on those alternative networks like the WB, UPN, FX, TNT, USA and Showtime, but there's not a single nominee that doesn't deserve to be on the list. Some of the choices are kooky, sure, but marvelously courageous — like Stockard Channing in "Out of Practice," Lisa Kudrow in "The Comeback" and Geena Davis in "Commander in Chief." I just love it when the Emmys totally go their own way and don't care if a show's canceled.

Robert Licuria: For Drama Series, no "Lost" - these are a good mix. I'm happy about them overall, except, "Six Feet Under" did so well elsewhere. It deserves to be here.

Chris Beachum (Boomer): I actually got 4 out of 5 correct on my predictions in this category but am not shocked by a final goodbye to "The West Wing."" There are such discrepancies, though. How do the shows "House" and "Sopranos" make it in the big category but their biggest reasons for success (Laurie, Gandolfini and Falco) are snubbed? How do they NOT nominate last year's winner Lost? In fact,"Lost" got majorly snubbed today with only one acting nom — for Desmond of all people.

Tom O'Neil: Look at all of the nice things you guys are saying about the drama nominees, in general. Sounds like you're starting to agree with me! But, personally, I weep no tears over the snub of "Lost." All five shows that beat it to the drama lineup are superior, I truly believe. Do agree with Chris, though, about snubs for Laurie, Gandolfini and Falco. Sad, sad, sad. Look at the bright side: that terrif nom for Denis Leary!

Robert Licuria: Good for Denis Leary (poster child for the new system along with Lauren Graham). But no Gandolfini and Falco is just embarassing. Really.

Chris Beachum (Boomer) : Completely embarassing snubs, but there is an embarassment of riches in the drama field overall, so I think most of these nominees are deserving. I am amazed that both of last year's winners (Patricia Arquette and James Spader) were left out. Geena Davis was good, but come on? Martin Sheen and Allison Janney come back from nowhere?

Robert Licuria: The supportings in drama were very good selections; more akin to what we expected. Some "Huff," some "Sopranos." Disappointed to not see Lauren Ambrose and Rachel Griffiths.

Chris Beachum (Boomer): Of course the supporting categories were not involved in the new voting system, and they are some of the best nominees to be found. Michael Imperioli becomes the only "Sopranos" performer nominated this year (and the least deserving). I am so pleased to see Gregory Itzin and Jean Smart as the first non-Sutherland actors recognized for "24."

Robert Licuria: Comedy offered plenty of shockers: No Housewives. No Entourage (a lesser shock). Two and a Half Men? Wow. Thrilled about The Office and Scrubs.

Tom O'Neil: The best thing about the comedy lineup is that it ended up paying overdue homage to traditional knee-slappers often dismissed as silly sitcoms: like "Two and a Half Men" and "King of Queens." When TV pros sitting on judging panels looked at them up close, voters ended up giving those shows the recognition they probably deserve. That fabulous curmudgeon TV critic Robert Bianco of USA Today keeps telling us that "Two and a Half Men" is really a great show and it's time that we all woke up. Now Emmy voters are backing him up. Maybe we should admit that they might be right.

Chris Beachum (Boomer): Well, many of us had suspected that the new system might not favor a non-traditional "comedy" like Desperate Housewives. Curb Your Enthusiasm over Entourage is no big surprise, either (since HBO was going to get at least one slot). I'm glad to see the gone-but-beloved Arrested Development was remembered. The Office and Scrubs are incredible choices. The voters finally woke up and booted an undeserving Will and Grace. Actually, this category is not bad at all.

Tom O'Neil: Yay, Boomer!

Robert Licuria: The comedy leads include Stockard Channing? Kevin James? No Housewives? No Mary-Louise Parker? Wow. On the other hand, ecstatic to see Lisa Kudrow, Jane Kaczmarek and Julia Louis-Dreyfus here.

Chris Beachum (Boomer): Yes, here is where the wheels come off the Emmy cart. The fact that the Lead Actress category has four (count them, four) out of five ladies from CANCELLED shows. The only one still on TV is JLD. I can live without the Housewives in this category, but the snub of Mary-Louise Parker is unforgiveable. The same goes for Jason Lee and Zach Braff (especially for low-grade performers like Kevin James and Charlie Sheen).

Tom O'Neil: The fact that 4 out of the 5 funny ladies are from canceled shows is what is so GREAT about the Emmys! Shows what great guts Emmy voters have and how little value they put on Nielsens when they look at shows carefully. I agree with you and it's bad news that Mary-Louise Parker and Zach Braff weren't nommed. I'm really bummed about that.

Robert Licuria: The supporting comedy lineups have lots of omissions, but the most embarrassing nod is Alfre Woodard. All due respect, but it looks so bad when she is the only Housewife nodded.

Chris Beachum (Boomer): I think even Alfre is embarrassed by this nomination (and probably her time spent on Wisteria Lane, for that matter). On the plus side, the mass Emmy voting public (which did a better job than the panels), finally chose to honor Will Arnett over Jeffrey Tambor, plus Jeremy Piven (who will win), Jaime Pressly and Elizabeth Perkins. Good job, mass voters (except for Woodard)!

Tom O'Neil: Good job, mass voters for picking Woodard!

Chris Beachum (Boomer): In conclusion, the new system certainly "worked" (if by worked we mean showed its ugly teeth), but it needs a major overhaul by next summer. Maybe they should try some sort of combination between the popular vote and the panel vote. Combine them together to get a better representative feel of what the Academy members want to nominate. Also, this Emmy show will feel much more like a farewell party with so many cancelled or retired shows and stars ("West Wing," "Commander-in-Chief," "Six Feet Under," "Huff," "Arrested Development," "Will & Grace," "The Comeback," "Out of Practice," "Malcolm in the Middle"). Farewell to the relevance of the Emmys, too, if they can't get their act together next time.

Tom O'Neil: I agree that the Emmys need to tweak the new panel system. Clearly, they didn't get the result they wanted. But these results are worthy and, most important of all, they're noble and eye-opening and fascinating and good. Emmy leaders had the best intentions and they tried something new, daring and heroic and I applaud them for it. Except for snubbing "Desperate Housewives." It had another brilliant past season — the TV critics are wrong, wrong, wrong.